On-Off Timer

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hello everybody!
i having difficult time trying program quite simple on-off timer different times. need this:ù
-turn on pin 4 x seconds
-turn pin 4 off , wait y seconds
-turn pin 5 on x seconds
-turn pin 5 off , wait y seconds
as far goes, have no big problems, when try time whole action, never stops.
for example, above routine go on let's 30 seconds, x time equal 5 seconds , y time equal 3 seconds. can routine, don't know how make last 30 seconds.
if necessary can post code here, wanted see whether suggest better way of doing this
thanks in advance

look @ blink without delay in examples, should give start.


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